It's been a long time since we've had much to discuss about White Water. We've pretty much all been in agreement for a long time that the park has fallen behind the competition, and now with a new $400+ million water and adventure park coming to town it looks like it will need to somehow put up or shut up.
Unfortunately, I'm not sure how much control HFEC has over the current property. It's been a long time since I looked into it, but I thought it was a lease or partial ownership situation. In any case, it's not a big property, though they could pack a lot more in.
They showed signs of life a few years ago when they added the new drop slides and replaced the lazy river. It seemed like they were slowly moving through the park revitalizing everything, but it's dropped off since then.
Think there's any hope for this property long term?
Are we completely sure that this new thing isn't connected with HFE in any way? They mention whitewater generically a lot in the article (without saying White Water), and the guy was connected with HFE at one time.
I didn't see any connection to HFE. A lot of people in this area worked at a HFE property at one time, seeing as they own half the big attractions in town.
I'm guessing White Water has been a cash cow for the HFE....it makes plenty of money without having to keep up with the Jones around the country. Water parks are not destination attractions beyond the local area. Since it is tied with SDC....WW will probably always have the advantage over other parks for getting the extra water park money from tourists.....I'm guessing Branson could support 4-5 indoor water parks (in hotels) and 2 major outdoor parks. I thinking the next generations of Branson visitors are going to prefer water parks over lake days.
Quote from: HumphreyHawk on July 21, 2018, 03:43:42 PM
I'm guessing White Water has been a cash cow for the HFE....it makes plenty of money without having to keep up with the Jones around the country. Water parks are not destination attractions beyond the local area. Since it is tied with SDC....WW will probably always have the advantage over other parks for getting the extra water park money from tourists.....I'm guessing Branson could support 4-5 indoor water parks (in hotels) and 2 major outdoor parks. I thinking the next generations of Branson visitors are going to prefer water parks over lake days.
Last stand alone Water Park I went to on purpose and not part of a theme park like the one at WOF and SFSL was Volcano Bay and Aquatica. After having done those there ain't any desire to go to White Water. It sends no thrill up my leg. It needs 80% gutted and redone with something designed within the past decade. Outside of the rather tame drop box slide addition, that park might as well stuck in 1995
We did the dual pass this year and went to WW once so far this year. I am not impressed, but then again I am not really into water parks in the first place.
So no word about anything for White Water today... If they were to get something, it would be a second announcement in either early Nov. or Spring before opening. Not sure if I see them doing that.
Something's gotta give eventually, right? The new $440+ million water park down the strip is going to start construction next year.
Quote from: shavethewhales on October 19, 2018, 08:47:30 PM
The new $440+ million water park down the strip is going to start construction next year.
?? Really?
I thought that project fell through, due to lack of city backing and very little if any tax breaks.?
Quote from: sanddunerider on October 20, 2018, 12:04:04 PM
Quote from: shavethewhales on October 19, 2018, 08:47:30 PM
The new $440+ million water park down the strip is going to start construction next year.
?? Really?
I thought that project fell through, due to lack of city backing and very little if any tax breaks.?
Sand, that's what I thought, also - that the tiff grant was not approved. And, wasn't there plans for a smaller water park going in somewhere? No where near that price tag?
Quote from: Gilligan on October 20, 2018, 01:02:58 PM
Sand, that's what I thought, also - that the tiff grant was not approved. And, wasn't there plans for a smaller water park going in somewhere? No where near that price tag?
Gillagan.. your thinking about the one at SOTH and Rourk.. been working on it for a year.. It is owned by Wetsgate. building it next to "Drafts", which is also owned by westgate..
the facility is primarily for the time share owners but will be open to the public, IF and when they get it finished
My worst hotel experience in Branson happened at there at Westgate. Absolutely horrible service.
Quote from: Okiebenz on October 22, 2018, 05:48:24 PM
My worst hotel experience in Branson happened at there at Westgate. Absolutely horrible service.
LOL,
thats why they are now involved with a Theatre,
Own a "sports bar",
and building a water park..
to offer their customer what the other guys,
to "tease" there potential buyers...
The Westgate one isn't 400million. Seems some "special interests" killed the tiff funding the big one was seekimg.
Oh wow, I completely missed when the TIF for the big water park was voted down. After the commision voted to recommend, I assumed it was in the bag.
For anyone else who missed it: https://www.news-leader.com/story/news/local/ozarks/2018/04/25/developer-considers-alternate-locations-water-park-after-branson-denies-tax-breaks/551358002/
From skimming some articles, it sounds like typical Branson tribalism. All the little mom and pop places banded together and kept the big players out. It will be the death of them, but eventually capitalism will run it's course and Branson will implode when younger generations turn up their nose at what Branson is currently offering outside of SDC. This would have been a game changer.
I guess that's even less pressure for White Water to change. Honestly, HFEC was probably involved in swaying some opinions as well. They are mercilessly protective of their Branson interests.
I still assume White Water can't be doing that well though... I could be wrong, haven't been by to check in years.
Quote from: shavethewhales on October 22, 2018, 09:08:09 PM
Oh wow, I completely missed when the TIF for the big water park was voted down. After the commision voted to recommend, I assumed it was in the bag.
For anyone else who missed it: https://www.news-leader.com/story/news/local/ozarks/2018/04/25/developer-considers-alternate-locations-water-park-after-branson-denies-tax-breaks/551358002/
From skimming some articles, it sounds like typical Branson tribalism. All the little mom and pop places banded together and kept the big players out. It will be the death of them, but eventually capitalism will run it's course and Branson will implode when younger generations turn up their nose at what Branson is currently offering outside of SDC. This would have been a game changer.
I guess that's even less pressure for White Water to change. Honestly, HFEC was probably involved in swaying some opinions as well. They are mercilessly protective of their Branson interests.
I still assume White Water can't be doing that well though... I could be wrong, haven't been by to check in years.
Parrot Island in Ft. Smith(owned by the City and county)is converting a body slide to a tune slide and adding a wave simulator ride. That will be popular and less incentive to visit White Water for some local market folks.
The 2019 WW guest survey asks you to rank interest in the addition of body slides, large raft family rides and a grotto activity pool.
Anything about an adult pool with floating bar? :o :o
Quote from: sanddunerider on June 04, 2019, 01:15:40 PM
Anything about an adult pool with floating bar? :o :o
Now that might make me buy season passes.
Quote from: sanddunerider on June 04, 2019, 01:15:40 PM
Anything about an adult pool with floating bar? :o :o
I'm surprised that SF doesn't have one. They do at OOF/WOF
Quote from: Runner1960 on June 05, 2019, 02:59:11 PM
Quote from: sanddunerider on June 04, 2019, 01:15:40 PM
Anything about an adult pool with floating bar? :o :o
Now that might make me buy season passes.
Then they might have to add in "adult hours". LOL... maybe sit in pool haivng drinks and concersation or maybe a movie screen in the background..
Obviously COVID has ground things to a halt, but it sure seems that WW development has dropped off.
Wasn't the drop slide the last major new ride? That was back in 2014...
We've always said WW is undersized, but they were making some great strides there for awhile with all the upgrades. I am amazed that competition has not moved in on them, but obviously it came pretty close with the big proposal a few years ago.
It is a shameful excuse of a Waterpark for who owns it.
Have there been any announcements about White Water upgrades this off-season? has anyone seen any work going on?
The lack of significant investment in White Water keeps making me think part of the $500 million decade-long SDC improvement will be a new Water park adjacent to SDC.
Yes the new waterpark is inevitable at this point. I wonder if they'll send the existing slides from White Water to one of their newly acquired waterparks. They'll have zero problems selling the land to Ballparks of America. They recently bought the old Rosebud Hotel that's right behind the employee parking lot of WW
Quote from: Swoosh on March 20, 2025, 10:18:21 PMYes the new waterpark is inevitable at this point. I wonder if they'll send the existing slides from White Water to one of their newly acquired waterparks. They'll have zero problems selling the land to Ballparks of America. They recently bought the old Rosebud Hotel that's right behind the employee parking lot of WW
SDC/HFE does not own the land that White Water currently sits on. That land is owned by the City of Branson, and leased to them. The City of Branson also owns the land that Ballparks sits on.
Quote from: ISTATE on March 25, 2025, 11:05:02 AMSDC/HFE does not own the land that White Water currently sits on. That land is owned by the City of Branson, and leased to them. The City of Branson also owns the land that Ballparks sits on.
I'm curious why you say it is leased. The county GIS shows whitewater land as owned by whitewater and the ballpark land owned by the ballparks of America.
Quote from: Lampie on March 26, 2025, 09:35:41 PMQuote from: ISTATE on March 25, 2025, 11:05:02 AMSDC/HFE does not own the land that White Water currently sits on. That land is owned by the City of Branson, and leased to them. The City of Branson also owns the land that Ballparks sits on.
I'm curious why you say it is leased. The county GIS shows whitewater land as owned by whitewater and the ballpark land owned by the ballparks of America.
Parcel
Parcel ID 07-7.0-35-000-000-034.001L
Property Address 3505 W 76 COUNTRY BLVD
Tax Code 4CXB
Sec/Twp/Rng 35/23/22
Brief Tax Description IMPROVEMENTS ON LEASED LAND; CITY OF BRANSON
If I recall, it's a pretty screwy arrangement with multiple parties involved. The lack of investment over the past decade shows that it isn't working out too well these days. It's not that the demand isn't there, it's just that HFEC isn't seeing the ROI somehow based on the current arrangement. If HFEC owned WW outright, it would be twice the size it is now with new additions every few years at least. Right now they just seem to keep it maintained enough to not taint their brand.
I wonder what happens to it after HFEC divests... I imagine they will try to keep it going as-is. Can't beat the location, so if they just keep it maintained it should be able to stay in business at least.